Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Hello and welcome to the Med Mentor podcast. This is Dr. Tracy Lawyer. I’m orthopedic surgeon in Boise and we are doing episode 10, which is…
Danny: fantastic. We have a fantastic Danny here. Danny, hello, how are you? Hey, Dr. Lawyer. I’m doing great. Great to be here. Thanks for having me. Absolutely.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And Danny has a wonderful story, wonderful background that we’re going to kind of delve in a little bit and talk to you about some advice and anything you have for… pre-medical students or even like, heck, medical students in the first year. So we’ll start with the easy questions. So what year are you in medical school? So I am a first year at ICOM here in Boise. Perfect. And so it sounds like you guys are nearing the end. Does that sound about right? Yeah, we just finished. So we have our second block of the spring semester. And so we have one more and then we’ll finish up just before the end of May. Oh, and then to what… what did you finish? What block did you finish?
Danny: Sure. Yeah, we just finished our cardio block and we’re going into pulmonary next. So lots of rest. Yeah, yeah. And it sounds like you just finished some exams.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So you’re just like probably a little tuckred out. A little bit. You know, kind of ignored some personal wellness the last week or so. But you know, it all ebbs and flows.
Danny: Yeah, it does. It does. Well, good. I’m glad that you took time to be here. I think that the audience and a lot of these aspiring future docs are going to just love this episode.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So we’re going to start out. So you have a very, very cool, very interesting background. So walk us through your journey because you had some extensive military service and then going into…
Danny: to medical school. Yeah, sure. So I’m definitely kind of the picture perfect example of a non-traditional student with… there really isn’t one. So I guess I shouldn’t say that. But to give it some perspective, there was like 11 almost 12 years from my under… to like starting medical school. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. So like, you know, some people think, oh, I don’t know if I should take a gap here or if I should go do this research or, you know… just travel or do whatever. Like, there’s no like perfect plan to get to medical school. And so hopefully I can be an example of that. So yeah, I was… just kind of in college at Ohio State in Columbus, Ohio, and got an email one day cold, cold, basically asking… if I was interested in like the scholarship that would pay for school and do all this stuff. I was like, yeah, it sounds pretty good. Yeah. So I did a joining the army. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And that just kind of took me on this journey that I didn’t expect. So it definitely was one of those things that, you know, I don’t think I intended it to be…
Danny: sort of like a first career in the sense that it was, but you know, I was really surprised at how much of… it’s really a business. And I guess you… it’s an organization of people. It’s people driven and I love that. That’s kind of what I love about medicine as well.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so that’s what kept me around. And so I think for a long time, you know, it felt a little transactional. Like, okay, I’m going to join the army.
Danny: Pay for school. Do my time and get out.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then I go do my thing. Right. But really, you know, it brought me so many opportunities that I would have never had otherwise. And so that…
Danny: just kind of, you know, took a very long and winding road to get to here. So without going into too much more detail, you know, I never thought that… I would have spent over a decade doing that before kind of getting back to the idea that I wanted to be in medicine. That I wanted to be a doctor because I had that idea, you know, in college.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And before that, but didn’t really have a good plan on how to get there. And so…
Danny: Yeah, no, I think that’s great. I think it’s fantastic. So I also… I think a lot of students will have this opportunity or this offer to go into military. You know, you get your schooling paid for, right? To me that… It’s like ideal because if you think like I had a bunch of student loans coming out of school. I also had that happen and had like a recruiter come.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And they always come to like the schools and whatnot. And it was very, very tempting. And I was just like, oh, I don’t know if I can give like I think it was like five or seven years. I was like, yeah.
Danny: But they’re going to pay for everything. So it was very tempting. But I think it’s more common though than people realize. Like going in and getting… I have a lot of… I have a lot of students and people that I fellas and stuff that went through kind of the military process.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And they’re kind of…
Danny: First they’re like, yeah, I don’t have any loans. And they did have to spend a certain… I think in like a military hospital for a while through their training and everything.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So what do you say to people that maybe have that recruiter come up… to them like, what are the pros and cons of it of going that route?
Danny: Yeah, you know, it’s certainly personal to every person. But what I would say is just… have an open mind about what it could be, which, you know, can be difficult because it is really ambiguous. But really it’s more about what you make of the situation. You know, I’ve had the pleasure of working with so many wonderful soldiers, airmen, etc.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And you know, for every person who had a bad attitude or just complained about everything, there was four or five people who just made the best…
Danny: of the situation. Really so I think just having a good attitude about it makes all the difference. But in terms of a person that might be considering it like either before medical school. Or in medical school. You know, if you’re at a point in your life where you’re open to some adventure or, you know, just travel and like seeing… other things that you might not have otherwise, it’s worth the consideration. Sure. And you know, you can always say no if you don’t want to before, you know, you kind of sign on the dotted line.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So to say. But it’s not something I would have imagined for myself to ask me when I was in college. And it was one of the best decisions I ever made.
Danny: Nice.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so do you have anybody in your family who is army or military or anything like that?
Danny: I have a couple like just in relatives and an aunt who are in an air force. But nobody that’s kind of gone like in this sort of trajectory that I went.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So it was a little more of a discovery.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So explain the process. Yes. And you are considered non-traditional. I thought I was non-traditional. I took seven years off.
Danny: You trump me. So that is definitely non-traditional. But that’s great. So take us through like the process when the recruiter comes.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Like what did you initially go into or where did you start or you know once you signed on the dotted line?
Danny: Yeah. So it was interesting timing because I know a lot of people whether like even in high school some people like talk to recruiters or doing you know. I was in the middle of my sophomore year at Ohio State.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so the timelines weren’t matching up. So I was a little hesitant.
Danny: I was a little bit hesitant to do it because I didn’t want to miss out on school.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I didn’t want to kind of push my graduation back or get in the way of any pre-emptive. And were you thinking about medicine at this time or no?
Danny: I was. But I didn’t have a great plan in place to be honest. I knew it was something that I was really interested in. I was a pre-med type of major like the things that I studied.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And undergrad were definitely in that direction.
Danny: I wasn’t studying for the MCAT like in undergrad or anything. Sure.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I think once I joined too that kind of distracted me from that path with all the other obligations I…
Danny: But looking back there’s definitely a way to do both. But to answer your original question I think. Yeah the process of kind of like what after sophomore year I guess.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So basically that summer I went to basic training.
Danny: Okay.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I was pretty much my whole summer. So that was like several months I went away down this. And then I went to the full Jackson South Carolina. And then came back and I was able to do like a split training because usually do like your
Danny: technical training like right after.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I didn’t list it as like a combat medic.
Danny: Okay.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So again I knew I kind of wanted to do that and that was a way to sort of get there. And you could choose that right?
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Or was that a toy? Or was that something?
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So there’s a proficiency test that you have to take and depending on how you score they sort
Danny: of give you a list of jobs that are available. Okay.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then depending where you live or like…
Danny: Like the units that are nearby like that they have different jobs that you might be eligible for. Okay.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I was able to pick that. So yeah you have to take that test and then…
Danny: Figure out what you can apply for.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So yeah. So after that came back to school after basic training. And then…
Danny: During that next year, my junior year, the ROTC program reached out and was like, hey, like we see that you’re like an enlisted soldier here. Like, you know, would you be interested in doing…
Danny: Yeah. Yeah. But it seemed like a better kind of deal at the time.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I jumped at it.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so then I commissioned as a lieutenant from Ohio State and then…
Danny: That sort of set me on a different trajectory because then the jobs were more limited. Okay.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I had to switch from the medical detachment of that…
Danny: I was with for a couple of years and I commissioned into air defense artillery. Oh, wow.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So like, yeah, like ground air missile systems which…
Danny: No, I won’t get too much into you but it was not ever anything I had expected. Sure. Yeah, yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So the thing with that though is that the tempo which…
Danny: My unit was like deploying was like really high.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so for the next like several years, like I was either like training or like going on missions or traveling. And did you ever get deployed then at some point?
Danny: Yeah, I spent a good amount of time, never in like a combat zone, luckily. But, you know, spent… A fair amount of time on missions here in States and some like overseas and in different areas like Europe and whatnot. But yeah, it just kind of took a lot of time that like… I bet, I bet.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I know, sorry, that was a bit of a… Again, it’s kind of a whiny road.
Danny: No, no, that’s… Really like when you’re talking to… Between the time that you’re getting the information like they might be a little pushy and saying like, Hey, like they want to get you, you know, sign up and say that. I know. Like they need numbers. But, you know, you can take as much time as you want and consider all the different options. So, you know, anybody who’s considering it, find the branch that works for you. Like whether that’s… Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and so you get to maybe a decade.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So, are you thinking of like, do you have to serve like a certain amount of time?
Danny: What’s the stipulation or what’s the… Yeah, originally there was a contract that I had to fulfill and then like as an officer, you’re kind of in until you say you don’t want to be anymore and you kind of… I didn’t really find a good time for that yet, but… Yeah. So, it was kind of just like, you know… I kept doing what I was doing, but I was really lucky in that like back in Ohio, I worked at the state headquarters there and got kind of a… I went away from like my main job with like the air defense stuff and got more into operations
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: and like leadership and got to work with like the general officers there in our state headquarters.
Danny: That’s nice. Kind of took more on like a project manager type of role and like was leading, you know, just other teams and got to do things a little more creatively. So, I think that… for like three or four years really kind of kept me engaged in a way that I probably wouldn’t have. Yeah. If I had just done like my normal job. So, that was really cool.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And got to work on a lot of really cool projects that were really actually, you know, like I said,
Danny: the army is like a people profession. Sure.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And one of the projects that…
Danny: I got to work on was called Hosted Health and Fitness, which is like the army’s way of kind of like systematically addressing a lot of the needs that… that soldiers have. So, there’s like five pillars of wellness, spiritual, physical, mental, sleep is an aspect.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, that was…
Danny: really cool to kind of delve into something that was passionate about and had experience in.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And just sort of build my repertoire of like, you know, these…
Danny: professional connections, but also the skills to sort of address those things, not only at like the individual level, but then like a systems-based level, which is really shaped how like… I see myself in medicine now, which is really cool. That’s awesome. Yeah. You had like a whole other life before medical school. Look at you. That’s great. I absolutely love that. But that’s good for people to know when the crew does come. They’re not like… It’s not like a scary thing. Like you’re locked in. There’s like opportunities to do of this. Sounds like a bunch of stuff. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And that’s why I say just hear them out because like you’re going to end up in rooms or places that you would have never imagined. And it’s going to take you to where… Ultimately, you want to be if you shape that experience, right?
Danny: Like I said, you get out what you put into it. Sure.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, sure, there are times you have to be with…
Danny: You know, you’re waking up early. You’re going, doing training, like running around the woods and sleeping in the rain. Yeah. Sometimes maybe not so much as a doctor. A training physician. Sure. Yeah. But you know, there will be times when you’re doing stuff that you want to do. Sure. Just like anything. So, looking back…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: The road is never straight, right?
Danny: Yeah, it never is. Yeah. Well, good for you. So, tell me then how did we get in like…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So you…
Danny: I don’t know if you get discharged or you kind of separate from them.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then, was it like… What do I do now?
Danny: Or was it like, okay, I’m ready for…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Medicine or did something kick that off or what happened during that time?
Danny: Yeah, I think just like being in the role that I was kind of describing before working on that project. Like, just made me realize like how much that side of me like really wasn’t being situated.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I still had like a genuine interest in doing.
Danny: Yeah. So, from there, I kind of like, wow, I was still doing that and working full time. Applied to a master’s program back in Ohio, case Western. Okay. Did…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, that was sort of like my way of bridging like this idea that I still wanted to pursue
Danny: medicine and kind of get back into that arena.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And the master’s…
Danny: Was that to get like, was that for like the academics to get for medical school or was that
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: kind of what was the impetus for that?
Danny: Yeah. No, that’s it exactly. You know, it was just I had been out of school for so long. Yep.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And you know, my undergrad, you know, like I said, I was out of Ohio State and I was having
Danny: a good time. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, you know, I didn’t have as much direction or purpose.
Danny: Sure. You know, as an 18 year old kid does. Yep. Absolutely. Yeah. It was just my way of like, you know… Like, okay, I really want to do this. Like, I should do something where I’m dedicating myself in a way that like, I can demonstrate one that I’m capable of the… Commitment. Yeah. You know, mentally, but then also like the rigors academically.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I think that that was…
Danny: That’s a good…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I think that’s a great like opportunity.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So it was always sort of evolving, but typically it was like a two year program.
Danny: Okay. It took a little bit longer for me. I had like some… Health issues and like an accident in that time.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So like it extended out a little bit.
Danny: Okay. But yeah, typically a two year program, which I know a lot of, you know, either… Post-bac or master’s programs that are health science related are actually in that range. Yeah. In that range. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So that’s good. So just kind of knowing that’s two year. And then tell me after that… Did you apply to medical school? Kind of like what were you thinking that like I know you’re in a D.O. school now? Are you doing looking at M.D. schools as well? What was kind of the path?
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I honestly kind of knew like I wanted to go to a D.O. program just because of the ideology.
Danny: You know, the project I worked on for several years called holistic health and fitness. Yeah, yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So that certainly shaped my approach to kind of like how I wanted to view medicine. So when I was looking into medical schools, you know, that really shaped my journey into
Danny: a D.O. school. Mm-hmm. So… That’s great.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then…
Danny: I don’t think the message program didn’t have an MCAT.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So you just kind of took that separately then or did you just kind of study on your own?
Danny: Yeah, I just kind of studied on my own. I am definitely not the person that I have to MCAT advice just because it was one of those things where like, you know, I didn’t study very diligently for it. Like I did okay. Like, you know, did above average, but like I didn’t do a course and I kind of took it a little haphazardly.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So looking back on like this journey, like if there were anything I would be different.
Danny: I would certainly apply myself in that more, but it was just one of those things where like, you know, I was working full time trying to do the master’s program and all this other life stuff. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I mean, I took mine without a course, but when I was in college and then I took it with the course and the second round I was like, ah, probably should. I mean, I was like, I’m not going to take it the course. Yeah. I mean, it was kind of expensive at the time, but yeah, I think everybody seemed to do better with the course. I think all the courses are the same.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So that’s good.
Danny: Yeah. Perfect.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then as far as going into D.O., you chose to come out to Boise and do you have family?
Danny: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then I just went through the same scope of like the holistic health and fitness day out
Danny: at the Air Force Base here. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so just happened to be here and like really loved the area like.
Danny: But there was a D.O. school here and was like, oh, man, I got to go check it out. Like had a little bit of time after. Yeah. One of the days that we were working and like saw it, loved it. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I knew that it was somewhere that I wanted to apply.
Danny: That’s awesome. Another example of like, you know, you don’t know where you’re going to end up. You never know. Yeah. You do have to keep your mind open.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then you know, within the military regardless of what you’re doing, like there’s a lot of structure and it requires a lot of discipline, but there is a more rigid. and just being a student, I was excited to the prospect because I was like, oh man, I did
Danny: well in this really tough program and now I’m like, oh I can… even get it more time and attention, I can’t wait to just learn and learn. Yeah. And it has been way harder than I thought just because the lack of structure on… Yeah. Which is great. It’s medical school, like really, just like I kind of said at the army, get out what you put in. But there’s a lot of… a lot of things like knowing there to hold your hands and you have to do anything.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So the lack of that external structure that was there with the military and a lot of the
Danny: things that I did before. I was really challenged me in a way that I’ve had to sort of build on those skills again of being more disciplined about my schedule, the way that I do things. Kind of more systematically and like, just staying on top of things. It’s been a really challenging transition but very rewarding kind of seeing the growth there for myself. Yeah. Especially from even the first semester to now. Yeah. And so tell me, I’m interested because I talk about like on other episodes, like how you learn and learning habits.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And study habits. Being a non-traditional, like when I went through, like I couldn’t remember what I did in undergrad.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And in…
Danny: I don’t know. I’m just gonna try a bunch of stuff and see what sticks. Yeah, for sure. And so I definitely didn’t know what was gonna work for me. I thought I had a plan and like… You know, that went to… Yeah. Yeah. Like after the first week I was like, okay, this is not working. Yeah. I think like the first week of school, like… …
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: When you’re just doing like intro classes and stuff, I was like trying to do everything.
Danny: I was staying up till like three in the morning just like reading like all these like textbook chapters.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then I was like, yeah, I’m just doing extra work and like it was just not sustainable. So it’s definitely been a learning curve. And I think I would say a lot of my classmates like…
Danny: Would say the same for themselves. Even the ones who are coming, you know, either straight from undergrad or grad school that have had a more linear path to medical school and more quote unquote. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I think one of the big challenges is that there are so many resources.
Danny: Yeah. Like there’s so many things that you can like buy.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So as much resources as you guys do like all the online stuff and the onky stuff. And I’m just like, when you guys tell me this, I’m like, you know what?
Danny: But yeah. Yeah. There is a lot and it’s probably great but it’s probably a little overwhelming maybe because there’s so much stuff. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and I’m a person that like I want to… Everything.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I’m going to look into how this works and like what’s the deal with this thing and like how can I integrate
Danny: XYZ to optimize my thing and like…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I’m doing 10,000 things terribly.
Danny: Yeah. So…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And did you finally have you…
Danny: I mean, you’re kind of ending that first year or you finally honed in on something that maybe works for you or… Yeah, I definitely… I have some sort of like check in with myself either like on a daily or a weekly basis like okay,
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: like how did things go?
Danny: Oh yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: How did I feel about this?
Danny: That’s really good. You know. Just… I think that I know that when they were alpha, they started fixing birthing. Right. Well I expect that, and I suppose earlier than time. But like with it up, so far, and when your service does it’s like, well, they turns out like you were in your YahooApp, or whatever. You’re a little harsh across the television or website, if you had either either place it goes up with on a regular basis to like kind of like talk to the lectures and like, okay, you talk through, you know, this pathology lecture and then like, I’ll do this pharmacology lecture. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I think it’s kind of still in the gaps while you talk about it, but it forces you to interact
Danny: with it in a way that like instead of receiving it, you have to deliver it.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I think that just for me. For me, switch is something in where you just have to have a better grasp on it, right? So I think that really helps me a lot.
Danny: Yeah. My dad was a professor and he would always see.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I think that’s very important.
Danny: That’s great. That’s really, really good advice for others.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So did anything about medical school surprise you after kind of your military experience?
Danny: That’s a really… really great question. I guess I knew that it was going to be fast paced coming into it and like being in the military. You’re used to like a high tempo, like being flexible, running on the move and just adapting. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And even in the…
Danny: you know, drinking through a fire hose. Oh yeah, just like medical school. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So there’s a lot of maxims that are repeated in medical school lecture halls that I have heard from.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So you know, how do you meet an elephant one by the time?
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So yeah, it’s definitely drinking through a fire hose, but in a way that…
Danny: I don’t know, I guess… I wasn’t fully prepared for just in the sense that, you know, it can be overwhelming to the point that if you fall behind even one day. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: You know, that’s crazy, right?
Danny: Yeah. That’s… You’re then maybe 300 slides of lecture material behind, which can feel… Like a mountain. Yeah. I don’t think people understand that. Like that when you miss one day, it’s like you’re way behind. I think that’s the scary part of it. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And once you experience it, you’re like, okay, well, I’m going to do my study.
Danny: I’m going to, like, if you get your study, I’m going to review it.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then I’m going to…
Danny: I think I’m going to do my study, and then I’m going to do my study, and I’m going to do my study. So, I think that’s probably the hardest part of medical school, because then you’re spinning your wheels a little bit, and then you’re trying to catch up a little bit.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, I definitely, I agree with you.
Danny: That’s hard. Yeah. I think that’s the reason why I wanted to do that for me. Like, it takes a little more time, maybe than other people.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, I thought I was going to have all this time.
Danny: I’m not working a full-time job. Right. Yeah. Like, I’m not doing all these other… Yeah. you know, you kind of have to.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And that’s not to scare anybody.
Danny: Right, right. It’s super engaging and it’s fulfilling. Yeah, yeah. But in some people… I know some people that like, they go to the lecture or they watch it on their own.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And they can move through it really quickly and synthesize it. And I am not one of those…
Danny: I need pass on pass on pass. Yeah. Really grasp it and apply it. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So absolutely this.
Danny: There’s some people that are just going to get it. Some of the friends are… You…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then you’re going to be like, seriously. And then there’s others that you have to try a little bit harder and that’s okay.
Danny: It doesn’t matter. You’re going to… It’s just however you digest it because you’re going to have to… Regurgitate it at some point. But it’s really important to absorb that information because it’s going to come back in the second year. It’s going to be repeated and then it’s going to come back on your board.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then as you can come back somewhere in your clinic awards somewhere and it’s going
Danny: to come back and… You know, like it’s going to come back.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So it’s really important just to understand what you’re studying. And that’s… And that…
Danny: I think people… That’s what takes a lot of the time. But that’s what’s different with undergrad is you can just take information and regurgitate.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then you move on to the next thing.
Danny: But medical school, it’s kind of adds on. Everything adds on top of each other.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So which is hard.
Danny: But… Yeah, but first year I would say is the hardest because second you’re going to have the classroom stuff again.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And you’re going to know.
Danny: You’re going to know like, okay, it’s going to take me this amount of time. To take in this information.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So tell me as a first year what your typical day look like. So for me… And I’m very tempted to say my ideal day would look like…
Danny: But can I say that because I’ve been really bad about like… Exercise. Which for me is like something that has been an outlet for me for a long time.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And it’s really kind of been put on the back part of this past year. So just a quick caveat that a lot of things that you may be passionate about or really
Danny: want to do. It’s something I held on to for a long time. For a little bit at the beginning of the semester and like saw myself struggling a little bit. That’s not to say you can’t prioritize it. But I’m working on re-prioritizing it.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I’ll say that.
Danny: Go ahead. Go. Go.
Danny: You rushed and then get to school by 7.15 to 7.30.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then look over the lecture material for the day.
Danny: Just a quick preview for the morning’s lecture.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So we typically have four hours of lectures from like 8 to noon on a normal day. And then depending on the day we’ll have either lab activities in the afternoon or some more
Danny: lectures or some other hands-on simulation type events.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So generally once I’m at school at like 7.15, have lunch at noon after four hours of lecture.
Danny: Next block in the afternoon. Which is either three or four hours. Then it’s five o’clock.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so by that time then you take several hours to kind of review the day’s material.
Danny: Redigest it. Do a second pass. Try to organize them the way that makes sense.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then if you’re lucky, look over stuff from either earlier in the week or like earlier
Danny: in the block. Mineo’s.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I try to do that in a way that I interact with material.
Danny: A little more frequently but it’s definitely easy to just be caught up in the day’s work.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And it can be 9 o’clock before I know it. And I haven’t done any.
Danny: Anything except for the lecture for that day.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I haven’t looked at the next day. So I know that’s kind of ambiguous but really it’s just like lecture or lecture or lab. And then I’ll stay at school.
Danny: I’m really, I’m somebody who does better studying at school. Then going home or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. I comes great in that like, you know, for the. lectures that aren’t mandatory in person for whatever reason. Like, let’s say we have a Danny lecture a lot of times, you know, you’ll have to be there. Like if something is necessary to be there in class, like those are mandatory. But otherwise, you know, you can watch the lecture asynchronously. You can watch it on the live stream and the library at your house, wherever, which is really great.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So many ways.
Danny: Yeah, which, you know, I thought I was like, oh, man, that’s awesome. Like I’m going to be able to like work out, watch this from home, you know, kind of like have my day. Then maybe. Maybe go to school and study, but I’ve definitely found that if I don’t go and like to watch in person, it’s really easy. Kind of like I was saying before. Let the lecture stack up.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And before you know it, you have four or five hours of lecture material to catch up on.
Danny: Yeah. On top of like a whole other day.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So yeah.
Danny: For me, it just works best to be there in person and watch the lecture. Yeah. No, I think that’s great. I also think that it’s hard to like what you talked about like the exercise. I think if that is the outlet, it’s hard to sneak.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then you’re like, well, I need to go and look at these lectures and stuff. And if that’s hard, that’s the balance of it, right?
Danny: Is your full time student you got to take whatever time if it’s actually. Or you know, doing some kind of hobby. Yeah. It’s pretty important to kind of fit in there.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So for sure.
Danny: Have there been any moments where you’re just like. This year where your motivation has been just low or moments where like I, this might be it for me. This week. Yeah. There’s been some moments this week that we’re looking pretty bleak. Yeah. Yeah. I think it’s all cyclic, but yeah, there’s definitely been moments of doubt. I think you know. You talk to any student, even the, you know, the brightest people like at our school and any class at any medical school, everyone who is there is intelligent.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And determined and hardworking and deserving of the opportunity of being there in whatever
Danny: medical school that you’re at. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I think it’s really easy.
Danny: To kind of fall into that mental trap of like, you know, the whole imposter syndrome thing,
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: right? It’s just like, do I really belong here?
Danny: I know a lot of times, you know, I catch myself feeling like. There’s somebody over my shoulder like watching like, man, like, when are they going to find
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: out?
Danny: Like, when are they going to notice that like, I’m not supposed to be here, especially being non-traditional. Like, it’s hard. You’re older. Yeah. Yeah. I get it. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I try to act a little younger.
Danny: I try to be a little more enthusiastic. There you go. People think I’m a little young. I’m a little young. I’m a little younger than I looked. Funny. But yeah, it’s really easy to fall into that mental trap of like, man, this is tough.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Do I really want to do this? And for me being.
Danny: So, you know, back home up to dogs and fiance and a whole life back there. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so it’s easy to feel separated and just like isolated. And when it gets hard. It’s like, is this worth it?
Danny: Sure. You know, and what do you do to kind of step out of that or come out of that fog or. You know, some time. Sometimes the best way forward is through it. Yeah. Which is a tough pill to swallow, but sometimes you just got to like, truck through it.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And that’s not to say that I would encourage anyone to, you know, compartmentalize things
Danny: in a way that they’re not addressing their emotional and, you know, like, I think that’s all that I do. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, you know, I have to be like, I’m like, you know,
Danny: Well, I’m like, I’m going to get the the go outside, literally like step on the grass. Yeah, that’s great. Look at the sun.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Those are all great tools, right?
Danny: Yeah. Because everybody who goes to medical school has hit. It kind of rock bottom and gone in the dark a little bit. Yeah. So, yeah. Because it can be a lot. It can. I think luckily for me though that being a non-traditional student is… Yeah. For myself and I think a lot of other non-traditional students that are in my class is that you really sort of fortified that like… Reason and just desire for doing this. To be here. Yes. Yeah. I completely agree. That’s why I tell people if you can take a break after undergrad… Even if it’s a year, I mean, I did seven, you did 12.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: When you get to that point when you’re a little older, I think you’re in it and… And mentally you’re like, it’s a little bit better than I think when you’re young. So I totally agree with that.
Danny: I totally agree. Yeah. I think… Anytime that you can have other experiences like if you are a student who’s going straight through undergrad and considering going right to med school. Like even if it’s over the summer where you get a little more professional or worldly experience, it doesn’t have to be an internship or anything. Just something. Sure. You know, your why is so much easier to come back to.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so for me, I think it’s a little easier than some of my younger classmates who did
Danny: go just straight… undergrad. Who felt maybe the pressure like, oh, I told people I’m going to do this, I have to do this. I know I hear that kind of a lot. There’s this expectation that a lot of… a lot of times it’s self-imposed but that is felt like is coming from these outside sources, whether it’s your friends or family and just what you think people want from you. Yeah. You know.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And you take the time to really consider why you’re doing it for yourself.
Danny: Then I think it’s easier to come back to. Okay. This is why I’m here. Yeah. Like it’s… It’s… anything that is ever worth being had is going to be difficult in some sort of way. But that’s what makes it worth it. Yeah. No, absolutely. I totally agree. Kind of… That’s a big one.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: What do you tell students who are struggling with that or with self-doubt? How would you…
Danny: I guess, come on, sort of give somebody a… Yeah. No, this is a really, really good one that I think that I’ve been kind of leaning into more recently. If you’re feeling that sense of imposter syndrome…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And this is a practice that I do sometimes is that I’ll write down whatever that evidence
Danny: in my mind is.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I’m telling myself, okay…
Danny: I don’t belong because XYZ.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then when I write it down and look at it, like is that actual evidence or is that just a feeling?
Danny: Mm hmm. Is that something that you’re experiencing or is it something within your control that you
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: can shape and influence?
Danny: Sure. Yeah, that’s great. Yeah. Which I… It’s something that has taken a lot of time to kind of cultivate and can be really difficult, especially when you’re feeling so overwhelmed. But just building in practices, like I said, for reflect…
Danny: A normal frequency. Yeah. No, I think that’s great. I think the self-reflection, I think the journaling, I think is all really important. I didn’t do a lot of that in medical school. I just kind of did that. I’ll have to outlet.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I just kind of like coed soccer and tap dancing and my running.
Danny: Like all the stuff for the outlets. But I realized now in practice I do a lot of that…
Danny: I think that’s a lot of practice and that can be overwhelming and whatnot.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And just to kind of do those check-ins for yourself, I think is very, very important for
Danny: mental health for just taking care of yourself.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I think those are…
Danny: points.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And then tell me about… So I know you probably had some good leadership experience in your military kind of career. So how has that kind of shaped your interaction with…
Danny: your classmates and in medical school with maybe some teams or groupings that you work
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: with in medical school?
Danny: Yeah. It’s been… awesome. I think medicine is like one of the best team sports.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I’ve been somebody who’s been involved with team sports since I could walk. So I’m a very team based person.
Danny: I love having shared goals and things that we want to accomplish.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so the same is true in the middle.
Danny: It’s all about collaboration, being able to work with others.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And it’s often with people from very diverse backgrounds and different…
Danny: you know, skill sets and perspectives, life events.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I think from that standpoint, the military experience is really…
Danny: really helped me be able to navigate just working with different types of personalities
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: and like different people who just…
Danny: you know, you might not even vibe with. You’re going to have people that don’t like you for whatever reason and that’s out of your control.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So you have to work in a…
Danny: in a way that is professional and you can have difficult conversations and be respectful or you can have, you know, even like a quick aside, like to make sure like you’re doing… things in the right way. But I think more than anything, it’s just… It’s taught me that, especially in leadership role, that, you know… in the military, we always say that you leave from the front and that’s not to say that you have to be visible, but you leave by example.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And my personal philosophy is that…
Danny: that the best leaders are the best followers and I really try to embody that. I never imagined myself more important…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: and that’s going to be true in medicine so frequently and in the real world. Right? And that’s just like more of a personal thing that like, you know, that I hold in regards
Danny: to people in general.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I try to apply that with a medical…
Danny: medicine and within school, but you know, there’s some people that may… you may come across that they can be arrogant. They have… they’re cocky or they have a different… bringing in things in a different way and it’s worked for them and that’s fine. But you’ve got to learn how to work with them too. Exactly. Yeah, you’re going to see all walks of life and you’re not going to agree with certain things. You’re not going to what not.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so, you know, my thing is always just…
Danny: I’m just taking care of you like you’re my family. That’s pretty much how I look at it.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So no matter if we disagree…
Danny: on whatever.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So my goals take care of you.
Danny: Listen to you. Because you need to be so… But I think that’s super important because you’re going to be as a… doctor, you’re going to be the leader of your team, whether it’s, you know, with your physician assistant, with a scribe, with the MA or whatnot, but like… I don’t… It’s like, jokingly people call me, hey boss, well I’m not really boss. Yeah. So, but these are… I can’t do my job without… these people. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And that’s really important that you give them respect and whatnot and don’t be arrogant. And so I think that’s really important. What would you say to… like, pre-med students starting to develop leadership skills before they even get accepted? Like how can they do that?
Danny: I would say… that a title is not a proxy for leadership.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So don’t go after something that you think has a prestigious title.
Danny: Because… one, it may not be a good fit for you and two, it might not, you know, present in the way that you think it would, especially when it comes time that you’re in front of a committee and you have to talk…
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: and you can’t really articulate in a way that seems genuine.
Danny: Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I would just say align yourself with things you’re passionate about.
Danny: Yeah. Find an area… of something that you’re interested in, see where there’s a need, and then take responsibility for something. Because that’s what leadership is. It’s responsibility whether that’s individual… or shared. Yeah.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so figure out what that is and, you know, chase that.
Danny: Yeah, no, that’s perfect. I love that.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: How has your perspective on patient care been shaped by… your military experience?
Danny: You know, it’s kind of sort of the way that we were just talking about, like teamwork. I think having been in… the room, like, of different clinics and watching a lot of different physicians, you included, like, that patient is just as much as a part of the team as any… … … anybody else. Mm-hmm.
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so I think, like you said, just understanding that people have different perspectives that
Danny: you’re not going to agree with. Like…
Danny: … … … … … …
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: so what do you think younger or more traditional, more linear students going straight from undergrad into medical school versus us, which are non-traditional? What could they learn from non-traditional past like the ores like mine?
Danny: um and that’s a great question and I’m trying to be concise because my mind’s going really different Yeah, it’s a hard one. Yeah, it’s a hard one. You know, I think coming out of like under grad especially in a high achiever and in everyone that is Pursuing this career path and is getting to a certain level like is a high achiever. Mm-hmm regardless of where you’re Whether it’s in the application process if you’re even considering it, you know, you’ve gotten to a point where like there have been enough people to tell you That you’re good enough and that you’ve passed enough Metrics I think that I had something that I kind of lost it. No, you’re good Like what I would I think about is Like my experience and stuff and traveling all over like I think that non-traditional students and not to say that traditional students are cocky or arrogant or anything. I think that they’re
Danny: Young and when they go straight through it’s like oh, you’re amazing You’re this that where I think we have these life experiences. I think you gained some humility a little bit
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: and perspective and
Danny: That you just I think that’s just with age right as well But I when I think about it, I just think like some of these younger, you know kids come Through and they’re 21 and it’s like yeah, I’m in medical school. Yeah, I’m gonna be this and that and when you’ve gone through life Experience and maybe be hit a little bit. Yeah, I’m gonna go in and you’re Like I’m just I’m happy to hear you know, yeah, no seriously. It’s like that like I’m good Like this is great is what I want to do on I
Danny: Compete Before I’ve done this before so yeah, no you you said it perfectly. Thanks for picking up Yeah, my my mush brain off the floor
Danny: Yeah, I think that’s kind of exactly where I was going with that is that a lot of times like I said these people are high achievers Yeah, and so it’s easy to come in and like you have to have a Certain air of confidence about you. So it’s very easy to think you know, like I am great
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And you are but I think with a non-traditional student like you said like you
Danny: Had other life experiences you’ve seen that there is more Than beyond yourself and really you’ve been humbled. Yeah, like you said like you’ve had an epic life experience You’ve humbled yeah more than you would have at 18 or 21. So yeah, perfect
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So how do you think someone can stand out when applying to medical school with a millet?
Danny: Terry background Is there anything special like That you think I think you know, it depends on the person and That’s not to say that the military experiences is not unique, but it’s also not unique, you know, a lot of people Do it, but really I think it kind of goes Back to the idea that it is what you take away from the situation and what you put into it So, you know a person person a maybe you know a ten years In the military and like and there’s myself and If you’re just there checking boxes, you know, you might not have had the same fulfillment or even experiences Or opportunities that come to a person who is doing things in a more enthusiastic way. So I think when it comes to your military experience or any Experience in general like you have to be able to talk to the narrative of
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Why it is you’re here when it comes to an application and
Danny: Committee that is looking to accept you into the medical school. Yeah, and that’s just the truth of it
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so you really kind of have to take a step back and think about your life in that way
Danny: Which is again kind of like another reason that I have grown to love like, you know Just the skill of reflection and its gratitude in a way that if you don’t do that Life can pass you by in a way that you don’t recognize Things are opportunities that you have had the the joy or privilege of doing
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And so
Danny: With the military specifically, I’d say it’s the same for everyone honestly It’s like how do you shape the narrative of your why? Yeah, and so I think with that you have to be passionate about what it is that you’re doing like Don’t do the thing because it has a great title or because it’s at this Deegis institution, you know committees can sniff that out Instinct because we’re gonna talk about it like you can tell that you’re you’re not you’re just not that into it. Yeah, we’re like It’s something that you don’t maybe even fully understand what it meant to you
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So when you explore those things on a deeper level, I think you can appreciate them And that sort of story for me is like if you look at my cb i’ve got stuff all over the place And that’s okay
Danny: Speak to it right with like yeah, I did this because xyz or you know because I wanted to go this path Yeah, but as long as they kind of like funnel into this narrative, that’s what matters. Yeah, so just think about that. Absolutely. Well good now kind of we’re kind of closing off here But if you could restart your pre-minute Journey, what would you do differently or would you just be like no it is what it is. I loved it. It’s great Yeah, i’m definitely a person that like I’m not big on regrets Like I try and not to say that I don’t make mistakes, but like kind of like I spoke to earlier. It’s like Is that a feeling or a fact like Sometimes it’s just information and that’s what mistakes can be so from that sense You know, I try not to look back and be like man, I wish I would have done this
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So sorry
Danny: For those that are listening that’s not great advice in terms of like what I would have done better But it got me to where I am today and I think ultimately wherever you are You might think this is gonna Attract from like my ultimate goal or this is gonna take me away from that and like You know, you’ll get to where you need to be Just by being Genuine and authentic to your own self. That’s it and it might take 11 years. Yeah, and that’s okay That’s okay because I know I wouldn’t trade it like you know all the other experiences I’ve had Have been worth it. Yeah, all the challenges and hardships. It’s made me better and yeah, I wouldn’t do anything differently Yeah, nice. I like that. So we’re into our rapid fire
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And some of this may not even make sense and you just kind of say what’s on your mind, okay? So the first one is discipline or motivation Discipline for sure. Yeah, why?
Danny: I mean motivation waxes and wanes, right? Like I’m a prime example of that with like my workout stuff like, you know I exercised like religiously for like the last like 10 years like on it doing all this stuff like straight from sports to this and that
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And you know, my motivation for that has just like gone out the window but When it comes to school, yeah, you know, I’ve had the discipline
Danny: to have the structure to To keep with it and so when motivation fails Structured and disciplined are there to pick you up. Yeah. No, I agree with that. Most underrated trait for success in med school
Danny: Oh Yeah, it’s it’s had one that is that’s a really great question because there’s so many good ones
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And if you can’t tell already, I’m a little indecisive because
Danny: Like I said, I like to think of all the options, but I’ll try to think of one that’s a little more personal. Yeah, I would say Humility is an amazing trait because again like we come Talked about like everybody that you’re gonna be around like in your cohort like they’re all high achievers They’ve done this incredible thing and like they travel the world and like they had a 4.0 It Stanford and you know, we’re in track and field and played soccer All the things yeah, and you’re like man, doctor what are she so Incredible like how am I even in the same room with this person like that doesn’t make sense. Dr. Lawyer has gone through imposter syndrome, too. Yeah, but then you hear their story and they feel the same exact way
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So just have some humility and I think that that goes a long way
Danny: I think something that I’ve really tried to adopt in the last few years is just like the ultimate sense Like vulnerability in the way that like when you do that and you let your guard down you connect with people in a way that is just
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So authentic and like more meaningful like
Danny: Not just in the interaction but the connection that you have with them. Absolutely. Yeah, so yeah, I think your patience will your patience will really love and respect Humility in a doctor and they they patience hate and just think about you being a patient and a doctor walks in and they’re arrogant
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And they’re telling you what to do and they’re you know, it just doesn’t vibe right?
Danny: I don’t care where you’re from. Yeah, that just when but when you come in with a little bit of humility a little bit of
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: Hey, how can I help you kind of just like what?
Danny: Whatever you need me to do. We’re gonna work this out together as a team. Yeah, it patience love that. Yeah, no matter no matter what special
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So that’s great one habit every pre
Danny: Man needs to build today. Oh Sleep hygiene sleep hygiene perfect put your phone away from your bed like A bed at relatively the same time every night. Yeah, and I am preaching to the choir because this is not something that I am doing very well right now I love it. Yeah, and I can feel it so Yeah, sleep hygiene and yeah, just try to get basic. Yeah, literally put your phone on the other side of the room You know, make a rule for yourself like I’m not gonna scroll on whatever Last time like whatever, you know something. Yes. Yeah, I would ask also add is like after an exam Don’t like think about like the Oh my gosh, like the like I used to do that all the time like and then you go talk to someone and they’re like you gotta be
Danny: Start just going in your head like way spinning. Oh, yeah, I mean If you look out in the hallway after an exam today for a perfect example like the next Hour is just like students milling around like ants like what’d you say for this one? What about this one? Oh, yeah You put B for that. Oh my gosh, and it just like I just failed it right and then It’s just like I I can fall victim to that sometimes just because you know, it’s like oh, I’m really like into it
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I want to know if it’s right, but then I also feel like I’m pretty
Danny: About knowing like okay, I can’t do anything about it now
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I’m not gonna let it like
Danny: Either like occupy the space in my mind or bring me down or bring me stress or anxiety so like It’s gone. It’s behind me. Yeah, I thought I don’t care about it, but you know, I can’t do anything about it
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So why give it all this time and attention? Yeah, I know
Danny: Biggest About medical school that you have to suffer Which I I know that like maybe I’m not paying the best picture of that because I’m talking about how I’m not Attending to all my habits in the best way right now But I think you don’t have to just constantly grind
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And be a martyr right like they don’t make the best doctors like
Danny: People want rested and thoughtful doctors Absolutely, so you don’t have to suffer to get here and you don’t have to suffer once you’re here It’s about striking a balance
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And it can be done right so it’s just
Danny: Finding what that means for you, you know, it’s still gonna be hard but Just you can’t pour from an empty cup and so you’ve got to take care of the things that you know Feel that cup for you, whether it’s you know taking a walk outside or You know just getting some sunshine playing sports Phone call with a friend or a loved one reading Journaling something anything. Yeah, just like you got to take some time in your day away from school To just be a person and like be there for yourself first because If you’re not there for yourself, you can’t be there for someone else correct. I totally agree Okay, last question one word to describe your first year so far
Danny: Yikes, it’s hard for you because you just end of the exam block so I know it’s gonna be hard I guess I’ll say Yeah, it’s so many things I want to say okay, okay. I love that. I love some options. Yeah, okay easy one Humbling I mean Regardless of your background Whether again you’re a 4.0 student from stampered or you know, you just squeaked in You’re gonna get humbled. Mm-hmm. So It’s it’s humbling but it’s worth it and I think Kind of always searching for that growth is so exciting and like Overcoming the obstacle or something that you didn’t think you could do before it felt like this impassable like Thing that was in your way is like so gratifying Not that that’s the point but like knowing that you can do that is so empowering
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And I would say that that has come in so many different ways and times especially when you feel
Danny: This looming sense of imposter syndrome that we’re talking about and like just not belonging
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So it’s it’s great to kind of like dig in the well a little bit and like okay
Danny: I can do this. Mm-hmm. So it’s been humbling but really it’s been exciting like I just I love learning which sounds really kind of lame, but like I love learning
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: And like to that’s how you got to continue to love learning. Yeah, and and I love people and like medicine. Like I said, it’s like it’s about people
Danny: it’s an ultimate team sport and You know, you kind of asked the question earlier like how did you know when you wanted to kind of move from the military to medicine or like
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: What was that and there was never really a time where
Danny: I was like, okay, now’s the time. Mm-hmm. But it was more of a sense of like not
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: When will I do this but like okay, I can know
Danny: I can’t do this. Right. Right. Um, like- I’m a good way to look at it. And I think you know that took 10 years to the point where I was like, okay Like I gotta go after this now. Yep. Not just because I was getting old but um You can do it at any age, right? Yeah. Oh my gosh. I’m a medical student. That was like in their 40s like any Yeah, there’s there’s multiple people in a class that are in their 40s have kids. Yeah had a whole career
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So yeah, it’s just been exciting and you know when you work so hard for some And you finally get there
Danny: That’s great, but that’s not enough like you really gotta be engaged and like enjoy the process and the work and it’s all those things so like I’ve really just enjoyed everything about it. I love it. Well, thank you and this has been amazing
Dr. Tracye Lawyer: So I appreciate you coming on board and talking with everybody. Yeah, thanks for having me. All right
